What Does Gender Have to Do With Buying a Car?
In August I took a monumental step towards becoming a real adult – I bought my first new car. I’ve had POS clunker cars since I was 15. This was my first honest to God, smells like a new car kind of car.
Thanks to a lot of prep work before I hit the dealerships, I was armed with information to save myself money. I also brought a friend with me who just happens to be a prosecuting attorney. I mean, hey ‘“ this isn’t a purse we’re talking about. You may as well bring out the big guns when you’re shopping for something as important as a car. Despite my prep work, however, I had a very frustrating, and revealing, experience when I hit the first dealership. I hope that by sharing my experience, I can save other women a lot of anger, and a lot of money, by encouraging you to be prepared for this very important decision.
Step 1: Deciding on Criteria
What are you looking for in a car? Is price the most important factor? Or will gas mileage be your decision maker? Are you a staunch believer in labor unions? Or are you only willing to buy cars made in the United States? All of these are important questions that you will need to decide before you do anything else.
For me, price and gas mileage were the most important factors. But I also wanted to have a reliable car, so safety and maintenance were high on my list, too. Since I’ve spent all of my driving life fighting with cars that break down on the freeway, I wanted to make sure that the car I was about to purchase was going to last me a long time. I would have preferred a union-made car (hey, I’m all about the ‘œsi se puede’), but that was not going to be the factor that would make or break a deal.
Step 2: Do Your Research
Having information is the key. Once you know what you’re looking for in a general sense, start to do your research on different brands. Kia and Hyundai are great cars for people who have a very low price point. They’re increasingly popular because they get great gas mileage. And both brands come with excellent 10-year/100,000 mile warranties.
Honda, Toyota, and Nissan are also excellent on gas mileage and dependability. My last car was a silver 1984 Nissan Sentra that I adored. The only thing that I ever had to worry about was the clutch, which is something that has to be replaced anyhow. The only reason I gave this car to a friend was because it didn’t have air conditioning, which is OK for someone living in Long Beach. But it’s not so great if you’re moving to Arizona. All three brands have a higher price point than Hyundai or Kia, though. So if reliability and gas mileage are more important than price, this is where you might set your sights.
There are lots of websites available to help you make a decision. Motor Trend, Consumer Reports and Ask Patty were all really helpful, especially since Ask Patty allows you to research a dealership to find out how woman-friendly they are. You should also go to the factory websites themselves to look at the invoice prices for the models you would like to buy. Print out the price page and take it with you to the dealership, because this is where you will start your price negotiations.
Step 3: Decide on a Dealership
Do you want something close to home so that it’s convenient to get your regularly scheduled maintenance? Or are you more concerned with the dealership’s reputation? I used Ask Patty to find woman-friendly dealerships in the Phoenix area. There weren’t any Kia or Hyundai dealerships listed on the site, so I ended up just picking one randomly out of the phonebook. Bad idea! I’ll tell you why in a minute.
Step 4: Bring a Friend
There is strength in numbers, and having a friend with me totally boosted my confidence.
Step 5: Timing is Everything
August is a good time to buy a car, because dealerships are clearing off their lots to receive inventory on the newer models. You’re more likely to get a dealer to go under invoice if they know they have to get rid of their cars than you are if they’re not that worried about something sitting on the lot for a while. If you have a dire need to buy a car, fine. But if you can wait, do it.
Learning From My Mistakes (And My Successes)
I made two big mistakes when I was shopping for my car. The first mistake was that I didn’t print out the factory invoice pages from the internet and bring them with me to the dealership. I have a penchant for memorizing numbers, so I could remember the prices I researched. But without a piece of paper to back it up, you’ll have to rely on the dealerships’ invoices themselves (which may or may not match the factory website).
The second mistake I made was randomly picking a dealership out of the phonebook instead of looking for a dealership with a good reputation. After my research, I decided to test drive the Kia Rio, the Hyundai Elantra, and the Honda Civic. As soon as Regina and I walked onto the lot at Camelback Kia and Hyundai, we were at a disadvantage because of our gender. There was no salesperson to greet us outside. When we went inside the dealership, we were ignored until I approached a salesperson to tell him we would like to test drive the Rio and the Elantra. The guy took us out on the lot before he even knew where the cars were parked. On top of that, he didn’t have the keys with him. After wandering around the lot in the hot August sun, the man left us outside while he went back inside to get the keys. He never asked us if we wanted some water. And when he came back, he had the wrong keys. We said we would wait inside for him. Again, no one offered us any water (we’d been standing out in the heat for a good 20 minutes), and no one offered us a seat. The guy finally comes back with the car. The salesman only allowed me to take the car out on the freeway for one exit, then I was told to get off the freeway and take two surface streets back to the dealership.
After ‘œtest driving’ the two cars, I told him I had some questions, and we went inside. First of all, the sticker price for the Kia Rio was almost $3,000 higher at the dealership than it was on the factory website. When I asked about that, he asked for my proof. I didn’t have the websites printed out, so I had nothing to back up my claim. At this point, the salesman stood up and took a very aggressive posture and then told us that if we were accusing the dealership of marking up the price and trying to rob their customers, we could leave. I said fine, but Regina asked to speak to a sales manager.
When the manager came over, Regina asked if it was unusual for two women to buy a car for themselves. She asked if we needed our Daddy or our husband to buy it for us. He said, ‘œno, women buy cars all the time.’ Regina said, ‘œapparently not at this dealership,’ and then relayed our experience to the manager. He gave a half-hearted apology and asked if we would like to see their invoice for the cars. I said that I was done shopping at that dealership. I also told him that I was paying for my car in cash, and that he just lost out on a guaranteed sale. We left, and I promised to put his dealership on blast. And here I am, true to my word.
My experience at Showcase Honda was 100% different. As soon as Regina and I pulled onto the lot, we had a salesperson greet us and ask if we would like to come in for some water and to talk about which cars we would like to see. He was an adorable young kid FOB from Utah named Sergio. Hey, Sergio! Anyway, it was his first day on the job, so a female sales rep came over to help him. She was great. She talked to me like I was a real person, and she let me have a real test drive of the Honda Civic. We drove out to the Phoenix Mountain Preserve so I could see how the car handles hairpin turns, and we talked down and dirty about airbags, anti-lock brakes, and all of the other safety features that make the Civic the most popular car in America.
Once we were back at the dealership, the real wheeling and dealing started. Regina and I had agreed on an absolute price point before we sat down to deal, and that helped. Regina is a thug. She negotiated the price mafia-style, writing her number on a slip of paper and then sliding it across the table. (I’ll admit that the first number we gave them was ridiculously low. But hey, it doesn’t hurt to ask.) The salesperson only had to go back to her manager to get a price approval once before the manager came out to deal with us directly. We told him our absolute price point and that he would have to give us the car under invoice since the sales tax and licensing were non-negotiable. He argued that the car I wanted to buy had a ton of factory upgrades, like tinted windows, mud bumpers, under coating, etc. I told him that I didn’t want any of that, but they didn’t have anything on the lot that was stripped down. I also said that I knew the new 2009 Civics were coming in September and that they had to clear their inventory, so I knew he needed to sell the car. He could sell it to me under invoice and I would pay cash that same day, or we would walk. He brought the price down within $0.95 of our number and Regina refused to pay the $0.95. It was the principal, she argued. He said fine, and we walked away with a brand new, red Honda Civic for under invoice.
Step 6: Talk to Your Insurance Agent First
The wheeling and dealing doesn’t stop once you shake the salesperson’s hand. You still have to go back to the financing department, regardless of whether or not you plan to finance your car. This is the dealership’s last chance to make money off of you, and this is when the real pressure starts. My guy was slick. He had visual aids, charts, and graphs to convince me that I needed to buy Low Jack and On Guard so that I wouldn’t get screwed if my car was stolen. Did you know that the Honda Civic is the most stolen car in America? I didn’t, but that’s what he told me. I knew that my insurance coverage would replace my stolen car, so I knew that I didn’t need the extra coverage from the dealership.
The finance guy also tried to convince me to finance the car, even though I had the cash to pay for the vehicle. He told me it would boost my credit if I would make one or two payments, and then pay off the loan, because my credit report would show a paid off car loan. Whatever, dude. I just paid off my student loans, so there goes your little theory.
The final place that the dealership is going to get you is with the extended warranty. Honda has an awesome reputation for reliability. And if you do all of your scheduled maintenance on time, Hondas will hold their value. Given my sordid past with POS cars, I knew before I even went into the dealership that I wanted to get the extended warranty so that everything would be covered. At 99,000 miles, I plan to take the car in to have everything overhauled so that I essentially have a brand new car before the warranty expires. And the extended warranty transfers ownership. If I ever decide to sell my Civic, I have a good negotiating point. If you’re a backyard mechanic, you might not need to invest in an extended warranty. But for a single lady who has had nothing but bad experiences with mechanics and tow trucks alike, I was willing to pay $2000 on the front end to have everything covered. I still saved a bundle on the total price of the car, so I think I did OK.
The Wrap Up
Buying a car for yourself is a very empowering experience for a woman. Remember all of those POS cars I talked about? With the exception of my lovable Nissan Sentra (which was a gift from my old debate coach), those cars were selected for by the men in my life. And boy did they fail me! I feel like I made an educated decision and I’m proud that I did it by myself, with a little help from a good friend. And I say there’s nothing better to advance the cause of feminism than for women to demand a smoking deal on a car!
If you’re in the market for a car, even a used one, arm yourself with the facts before you go a walking. Like I said before ‘“ picking a purse because it’s cute is one thing. But you really owe it to yourself to be a knowledgeable car consumer. I wish you the best of luck and hope that you don’t experience any of the frustration that I did at the Kia/Hyundai dealership.
What about other ladies (and gentlemen)? What has your car shopping experience been like? And do you have other tips to offer that I haven’t considered?
Photo credit: stock.xchng.
Congats on the New Car Serena!!
My family has had a New Car Dealers License for over 50 years and what you went through was about normal.
Every dealership has its own “culture” on how they treat customers. Some treat every customer like a dear relative or friend and others go by the axiom (especially those in large urban areas) that:
“There Is No Way They Can Ever Sell Even One Car To All Them So F*CK ‘EM”
Now the F&I guy was right on the money about the Honda being the most stolen car..along with Acuras, which are the same car just with a different nameplate and a MUCH higher price tag…you’ll notice kids souping them up and all the really dumb (IMO) add ons…fairings, low spoilers (which make towing or changing a tire damn near impossible so the cost of towing usually triples because of the added risk of damage..been there Charged That to the car owners }:~D), mufflers that make the car sound like a Sewing Machine On Steroids…but anyway they soup up the engines and street race them and blow them up…so parts are dear even at salvage yards.
The Hondas get stolen mainly to provide parts to repair the theives OWN Honda or Acura.
The After-Market Warranty was (IMO Again) a BAD Idea unless it was offerred by Honda itself and not some outside Shyster company…if its from Honda its a Neutral…but you best be prepared to have ALL your maintenance…Even Oil Changes..done at the dealership at the recommended intervals and keep every paid invoice…at the Exhorbitantly High Dealer Labor Rate too boot.
It’s not uncommon for the warranty people…even the manufacturers own…to deny a claim under extended warranty because you missed so much as a single oil change and showing that you had it done at other than the (or “a” factory) dealerhship falls under the heading of “Sub-Standard, Non-OEM Parts”…and they consider even Oil Filters and Oil in that category..so you have “Abused” the vehicle so the repair is “Not Covered”.
As for the F&I guys attempt to get you to finance for even a payment or two that might have actually been a good idea. Even though you would have had to pay some fees for “Loan Origination” it might actually have gotten you Cheaper Insurance down the road.
In my own personal case I’ve NEVER financed a personal car but when I got the motorcycle and contacted Progressive for insurance…though I got a very good rate…I got a letter stating that my credit was checked by them and I was being charged MORE based on it and I was entitled to a copy of the report.
I didn’t understand why and the report (from Experion BTW) stated that I actually had a slightly lower credit score BECAUSE THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE OF ANY LOANS TO BUY VEHICLES!!!
In other words Progressive charged me MORE for insurance because I DIDN’T have a history of Car Loans.
So the trade off for paying Origination fees for a Car Loan and a bit of interest for one or two months might have been offset by lower Premiums from you insurance carrier for the Seven years they would have appeared on your credit report.
Anyway Serena, Have a Great Time with your New Wheels!!
~ Roland
Buying a car at a dealership has been the most traumatic experience I know. You’re right, Serena…the key to success is preparation! And take along someone who is good at negotiating. I saw a man demand a price and they gave it to him. They could see that he would not budge. But their trick is giving you the runaround, and you will find that there are a variety of sales people who are specifically there to appeal to the buyer. We were also given a “brand new” young man, who wasn’t able to help us and had to call in his supervisor to take over. We then had the “seasoned” salesman who tried to railroad us. When that didn’t work, we got the “manager” — I put these in quotes, because I don’t believe that any of them were who they said they were, but rather a cast of characters that you can find at any dealership. Hooray for you for walking out on the first one. And it is a good thing to remember that you do not have to make a decision on the spot. You have the right to walk out and to think about it for as long as you want, or as long as it takes you to get other offers!! Don’t be afraid to tell another dealer how much the other dealer offered…they are usually willing to undercut the competition.
Roland, thanks for the tip about car insurance. Since I was added to my mom’s policy so that both of us could get a multiple driver discount, there really would have been no difference for me on the insurance rate. But it’s good for others to know that. Something I totally would never have considered.
Jane, I agree . . . there’s nothing that says you can’t walk out of a dealership and then go back and accept their offer after you’ve been able to price shop.
What a story. And I thought my one run-in with auto-creeps was bad. I went in expecting a certain amount of subterfuge and deception — they are salesmen, after all — but what I didn’t expect was the condescension. Like you, I had gotten one quote from the website (this was also Kia — what is up with them?) and I was treated like I was crazy for expecting to pay that price. I brought my mother along, who is a tough cookie despite not being an attorney, and she claimed they were using a bait and switch tactic. On that queue both salesmen began to foam at the mouth. Long story short, we left without a Kia and I’ve pretty much sandblasted them to every friend I have.
You pretty much cover all the bases with your advice. There are a few other websites I’d recommend, like http://www.carspace.com — which has this huge thread about “what car is right for me” — and http://www.carfunfootprint.com — which ranks cars based on fuel efficiency, carbon emissions, and drivability (all fairly important factors in my book, aside from price).
Also, if you’re a AAA member another tip is to find a car dealership with a AAA rep. I hear they are often the best to work with, and ridiculously honest, although I haven’t tested this out for myself…has anyone else?
i just bought a car also. i did some research and i couldn’t justify buying a new car or any car from a dealership. i ended up buying a used honda civic i saw listed on craigslist. the couple i bought it from was cool, they had all the paperwork, and they were just trying to get rid of their car and get more for it then they would have through a trade-in. this allowed me to get an amazingly low price, almost a full g below the kelly blue book value. they let me get the car checked out at a mechanic and were pretty honest about everything. another advantage was that they didn’t care what value we reported in the sales paperwork. this is huge because it determines the taxes you have to pay on the purchase. they let me report that a 9K care was purchased for a 100 bucks which meant i had to pay 6.50$ in takes rather than over 600$. ultimately i had a great experience buying through craigslist and got a killer deal. there are obviously some shady people trying to get over on craigslist but a lot of folks just want a quick sale, and are willing to go low on price. the bad part about this is that you need to have all the cash at once. its nice, however, to not have to deal with the dealership mark-ups and all the other fees they apply to the purchase. anyways, thats something folks should consider. it sounds like you came up tho. peace.
Cheryl, your experience makes me wonder if it isn’t Kia company policy to treat women like shit. I’m adding them to my list, along with Big O Tires, of companies that women should avoid like the plague.
DP, glad to hear you had a positive experience with Craigslist. How are you enjoying your Civic?
Serena, thanks for the interesting article!
Your post made me wonder if the experience would be the same or different for a trans person or a butch woman. When I was a lesbian straight people often read me as butch. At work I was considered one of the guys and was treated very differently than women who were more feminine than I. Now I identify as a trans guy. Sometimes I am read as a guy and sometimes as a dyke; I wonder what the salespeople would do with someone whose gender they couldn’t easily recognize.
I have had 3 cars in my car driving years, my Truck, the escort and now the toyota corolla. I have not yet had the opportunity to purchase my own brand new car… or any car from a lot- I have been the friend that goes for support. I went with my mom and played the car know it all.. and the aggressor. My mom isn’t very social so it was my job to fight off the sales people until she was ready to pick a car to test drive. Everything else you outlined sounds about right. The toyota dealership in.. Torrance, i think that’s where we went… was a great dealership and as 2 womyn buying a car, we had a good experience. The Huntington Beach Toyota dealership was good too!
Corollas are union made and are also great reliable cars. Mine is a 1997 and is in pretty good shape.
For me, I’ve decided to spend my money on maintenance instead of car payments, which isn’t a monthly cost… someday though, i’ll go through this experience, and I will certainly be prepared!
After my experience with a 1984 Ford Tempo that was a huge lemon for which the dealership was absolutely no help I swore I would never have a Ford again. Went with Honda back then and have been with Honda ever since. Also have bought every car since then from the same dealership. However, I have not always gotten the best deal I could have partly cos I was naive about how to go about the game of buying a car and partly cos I wasn’t assertive.
Well it was time this year to buy a new car. This time I walked in knowing the deal I wanted. Knew what my car was worth and what I would pay for a new one. I really did my homework before I walked in there.
The first offer for my trade-in they made to me I was incensed it was so low. Ridiculously low. It was obvious that they thought they could hoodwink a woman. They would not have lowballed a guy like that. I was insulted and I told them so. I think my candor surprised the guy.
To make a long story short I walked out of there with the deal i wanted…. got what I wanted for my car and got a very good interest rate on the loan. For once I walked out of a dealership feeling really good! I was and am so proud of myself. Not to say I did everything right… I paid sticker price. But I figured I offset that by getting the deal I got for my trade-in and the really good interest rate on the loan. The dealership got a good deal and I got a good deal.
And yes I did get the extra warranty bumper to bumper 100,000 miles. If you do your research on those warranties the experts tell you they aren’t necessary and are a rip off …. and in fact looking at the history of the car i traded in extra warranty coverage isn’t necessary. However, the peace of mind it gives me is worth it to me.
Don’t be afraid to buy used and don’t be afraid to ask to take it to a mechanic first! Given the massive rebates that car makers are offering on new cars, the value of new vehicles – especially American made – is problematic as the “employee pricing schemes CRUSH the resale market on used vehicles. I have now bought two used imports – Nissan and Toyota – the later i drove for 12 years and 120,000 miles. It was a terrific value and a great car. I bought a truck only because I need to haul and move things which my car cannot. Letting someone else take the hit for the loss of value when you drive a new car off the lot is a great way to transfer costs away from yourself. Used cars are cheaper to insure and license and, especially if you buy a “CERTIFIED” pre-owned model, you can get generous warranty coverage to take care of moving parts / mechnical (read COSTLY) repairs. Second, if you are buying used, and have a trusted mechanic, take the car to them and have them give it a once over. I did that with my truck – it cost $43. This was a great deal and the 08 or 09 versions of my 06 truck were $20-25K higher in price! Ask the seller / dealership if they would be willing to split the costs just so you can know clearly of any leaks, possible forthcoming mechanical issue or other repairs that have been done or might be pending (e.g. needed brakes SOOON!). If someone does not want you to take the car to a mechanic, that might be a trouble sign and time to WALK AWAY. Happy driving.
We are getting ready to replace our old POS car. This blog could not have been more timely. I’ll make sure I do my research first. Thanks!
Serena, I just love that you gave so much detailed information about your experience buying a new car.
You are right on money that being “auto educated” before you start shopping gives you a HUGE advantage when buying a new or used.
I own an independent repair shop and have advocated many times for my clients when they are buying a new or used car. It pisses me off when dealers or private sellers try to take advantage of my clients.
I am also one of the Female Automotive Advisers on http://www.askpatty.com, and love that Ask Patty has soooooo much information for women about buying, selling, repairing, financing, leasing, and anything else you might want to know about cars. AND all this advice comes from other female automotive experts.
Getting educated before you make a big purchase is the only way to make an informed decisions / smart decision.
You will pay less, and not end up buying a vehicle that is unworthy of the money you will end up spending.
Before you buy a car…do your homework!
Hi Pam – I totally agree that the extra warranty wasn’t necessary. But you said it best – it was more about the piece of mind than anything else.
Shannon – I’m not sure how a trans person would be treated at a dealership. I am guessing that the treatment would be bad.
Amy – thanks for contributing to Ask Patty. That site is such an amazing resource!
It’s a very good post and certainly one I would use when I replace my beloved green Saturn. (Which will probably have to happen at some point, but not anytime soon hopefully. Because I like my car.)
I went the Saturn route because I was a single woman and didn’t have a lot of friends to rope into it and didn’t want the bother terribly. And I had the money to just plunk it down. It was mostly not pressure filled, though I still did my research about it. And there was some haggling over the extras, bells and whistles.
And I take my car back to the Saturn dealership in Tempe for maintenance, and one of my female friends who also has a Saturn said that she got different treatment at the one in Tempe if she was with her male partner versus the one in Scottsdale who treated her more respectfully. And that may be true, but considering how effing far up the Scottsdale dealership is, I still choose the tempe dealership.
Serena,
As a female technician who worked for a dealership, I can only say that unfortunately the discrimination does not end once the car buying is over.
As many women will attest, servicing your vehicle can be just as painful. It’s hard to believe that in this day and age when women are making so many of the buying decisions, that they are still treated like they don’t know what they’re doing.
Many times I would be introduced to people buying new vehicles as their “female” tech. The interesting thing about this is that sometimes the women would come and find me to see if what they had been told was true. It became so bad that I now have a business that teaches women light maintenance.
No one wants to be ripped off or treated like they wouldn’t understand even if they were told something, yet this is how women are treated over and over in the automotive business.
Ask Patty is doing a great job to turn dealerships around and make them realize that you should be concerned when a woman walks out of your dealership for not being treated properly.
I agree, no matter what you’re doing, buying a car or taking it in for service, go in prepared. As far as I know, there still is no proof that men have a car gene and women don’t! Everyone is capable of learning about their vehicle. Don’t let them intimidate you.
Thanks Lori. Where are you located? I know a lot of women who would find your classes empowering!
I am in Philadelphia, but travel just about anywhere to teach my classes. They can check out my website at
http://www.ladiesstartyourengines.net